Tulpa.info - metaphysics

it seems like the more I practice the more I get feelings of reality being fake and that's both what gives the imposition power and causes episodes of psychosis and I'm not sure to what extent its even possible to uncross those lines

That sounds specifically like derealization. Especially since you seem to be aware that it's not actually true. True psychosis would be rejecting the truth of reality completely I'd say. Normally the concept of being psychotic is incompatible with knowing you have it.

you mentioned no drugs but did you use them before?

no I've never done drugs specifically so I don't lose control with tulpamancy

11:52 AM

but I might be susceptible to related illnesses due to family history

can you explain what you mean that you get feelings of reality being fake

its like I can feel the sensation of my visual senses more strongly and that's what I've placed all my grounding in reality in, but I can feel that wavering, and the feeling is like parallel universes and experiences dwell on the other side of that

what do you make of it?

I had some philosophy earlier I wrote that it might be we're all in control of our own universe completely but at the same time I have to go off the observations of outside observers and not my own perspective

11:57 AM

it feels like not just my senses but also the possibility that my entire past and presence in the universe can change on a dime

11:58 AM

like I might just start believing then suddenly to me I'm in a universe where superpowers are real

11:58 AM

which is not really a distant notion considering how much people talk about "faith" and belief being able to move mountains anyways

do you know what reality shifting is?

11:59 AM

it's practice where people convince themselves they are in other reality of for example harry potter and they can do magic, it can be very convincing

11:59 AM

i think you might be experiencing something similar

that sounds interesting

you might google it, maybe with this in mind you could have a broader view on what is going on

pair that with some of the more weird dreams I've been having and that's probably why I started derailing so much earlier

so do you have moments where you believe those things are real?

about a month ago I had my first experience and that's been pretty much the only time I thought it was real

as zen mentioned, requirement for psychosis is that you need to believe that what you are experiencing is real but it can come in episodes

12:02 PM

it doesn't mean one is psychotic all the time

12:02 PM

however if it was a result of going deep into your mind and trying to find truths about the universe, it might not be psychosis in my opinion

about a month ago I completely rejected reality for a brief while in that first experience and saw a lot of hallucinations far beyond the scope of my previous imposition, I actually got taken to the hospital because I lost control briefly

oh i see

12:03 PM

what did they say in the hospital?

it was acute psychosis, I actually entered a tulpa-like state then either a tulpa or a manifestation of emotion of some kind was in control, but I haven't had that happen again since then since I can identify when its happening (edited)

i see

12:05 PM

i hope you get proper help!

yeah I have been and its worked out for the better in a lot of ways and I appreciate your concern

i'm glad to hear that!

@hydrix95 Sometimes we can feel like enlightenment has something to do with finding Truth or attaining some kind of Knowledge

7:19 PM

Do you feel like you might view it that way?

Unfastened Belts

@hydrix95 Sometimes we can feel like enlightenment has something to do with finding Truth or attaining some kind of Knowledge

I can't think of a better way to phrase it, but if I'm reading correctly you might dislike the idea of absolute truth, or perhaps I've given the impression of feeling better than others

7:42 PM

it's actually been extremely humbling, because the more I've learned the more I see I'm only giving over control to something that was already there before me

7:44 PM

saying there is no truth is self-defeating, because it is to say that one cannot ever find the truth no matter what I've found its more rooted in fear of confronting others once said truth becomes evident though but there's no running from that fact of life

Im not so much making a point about whether absolute Truth exists or not

8:00 PM

Lets say there is such a thing as absolute truth

8:01 PM

Do you feel like finding it is "the goal"? Or do you think it's possible that a "quest for truth" may be the "means to an end" instead? (edited)

8:03 PM

To put it more bluntly, what is absolute Truth gonna give you? Whats the point of it?

what I found was that there was no point, everything is only a means for enjoyment, but once you've found, you have the ability to become a king and in that form be a force for good. To that end, since it feels like I'm giving over control to my feelings which originate chaotically from some place beyond my control, it seems I'm merely just an observer in somebody else's playground and nothing more, but I enjoy the process and have more joy in that than I've ever had before

8:25 PM

it gives you a lot of things including freedom and even riches, but I enjoy the process of "ruling" like that and giving to others even more

Hmmm sounds good :)

^ tbh

We find that only 1.5 to 7 percent of the modern human genome is uniquely human. (from https://www.sciencealert.com/a-shockingly-small-percentage-of-our-dna-is-uniquely-human-study-finds )

i think that if you try to learn about the truths of the universe just by thinking and exploring your mind, that assumes that on the deepest level your mind is the same as the universe and that connection would need to be demonstrated first before treating it as a reliable source of truth and any consider any conclusions you get that way seriously in my opinion if you explore your mind all you can explore is just your mind and that actually should be an opportunity for you to see how convincing for your mind illusions of truth or moments of epiphany can be people can explore that by trying to explore different ideas of how the universe works and then compare to each other, and notice that some very contradictory ideas can be as convincing. but if you get stuck in one thing it is impossible to notice and you can just go deeper and deeper into those very convincing illusions of truth and i know how philosophy can be seductive especially if you consider that brought us science, but i think the role of philosophy as a tool of exploring reality ended at that point and we should be using science for it otherwise we are flooded with a lot of false answers (edited)

10:19 AM

unfortunately when i see people diving deep into those things, they have a feeling of doing the 5th thing on this picture while i think they are doing the 6th, of course it's not "conspiracy theory" but the idea is the same (edited)

I've mentioned it before but in terms of literal enlightenment as far as Buddhists understand it - Their religion is keyed toward practices which are known to cause hallucinations. It's ingrained in Buddhist tradition that hallucinations, feelings, sensory experiences of insight and transcendence: all of it is considered a distraction from actually understanding yourself. (edited)

that's an interesting illustration, but i wonder-- at what point does intuition come into play in their system?

12:42 PM

without a doubt, there are different ways to connect those dots, and I guarantee that some of them are quite silly. Tho the monocerus constellation does contain the smallest and closest known black hole.

Intuition is required for hypothesis, not for the true formation of knowledge. For example, between information and knowledge someone must draw the unicorn, as it were, but then a correlation that actually shows that must be observed.

And in this manner, we can scientifically deduce the correct way to connect the dots and draw the constellations?

this seems silly to me!

Yes, because if we draw the constellations and then find they're nonsense and don't really have any correlation we're able to discard the unicorn.

12:46 PM

At that point the unicorn just becomes a coincidence

12:47 PM

Now that we understand the stars for example we understand that really stars that might be next to themselves in the sky but farther away from each other than stars on the other side of the globe, there's not likely an archer entombed in them. No real correlation is there other than the structure they were given when they formed as part of a galaxy through gravity and such.

nothing's fixed, but it'll take more than a few thousand years for some things to drift, and we adjust, almost without realizing, to thing that change slowly enough if we're not mindful

Indeed. Finding out that the stars aren't actually fixed spots is also a big point in deciding they're not patterned in a particular way.

There's no scientifically "most correct" way to draw the heavens, whether they're within the zodiac or not!

On the contrary there is. http://www.atlasoftheuniverse.com/50lys.gif

that's most accurate, not most correct

?

12:52 PM

Those are the same word.

not at all

Accurate describes closeness to truth. Correct describes something which is true.

12:53 PM

This is a purely reflective measurement of the stars at a particular time in relation to Sol. (edited)

12:53 PM

The thing it doesn't show is movement.

12:54 PM

But it fully explores dimension

accuracy is closeness to objectively measuring and representing things. what i believe tailpa is getting at is the much more subjective correctness. "what do the stars mean to you?" you can show exactly where all the stars are in space, but a map made for that is not very useful for astrology, so if you used that map, it would be the incorrect map (edited)

there's scientific observation, but then there is some process of interpretation to meaning, and then a question of how to aesthetically express or communicate that meme.

1:00 PM

it would seem as if there's a lot going on, then, because accuracy. And what's it accurate to? A specific region in space-time? The further the stars are from here, the less certain we are of what's going on today. We're looking at things that happened long ago.

What the stars mean is irrelevant. Meaning must be purely derived from accurate senses or they rely on rationalism rather than empiricism. Rationalism is bluntly, wrong. You cannot reason to truth using any core belief.

1:02 PM

There is a reason this isn't useful for astrology. Astrology is autosuggestion and doesn't reflect anything true at all.

you assume that there is value to accurately describing the position of the stars, and that there is no value to astrology

Au contraire, I have three tarot decks on this desk. There is a difference between things which are false and valueless.

1:04 PM

Astrology is false and can reflect the self.

What the stars mean is irrelevant. Meaning must be purely derived from accurate senses or they rely on rationalism rather than empiricism. Rationalism is bluntly, wrong. You cannot reason to truth using any core belief.

@Zen - jump

well then what exactly are we talking about? you say that the meaning of stars is irrelevant, but irrelevant to what exactly? I've gotten lost

I'm saying that if you're talking about truth - you cannot ascertain truth by reasoning alone.

But if the stars are irrelevant, than Friedrich Nietzsche is certaintly so insignificant as to be invisible and already forgotten.

you can ascertain certain truths by reasoning alone, though certainly not the whole picture

If something cannot be directly correlated to science then it doesn't have any real meaning. For example we can see that astrology works at making people feel like they're understood and understanding themselves. We also see that it's nonsense. These are things that are true.

1:08 PM

What truths?

Then science is deluded.

1:08 PM

Because it's an infinitesimally small measure of insight into reality.

1:09 PM

And it's incomplete. It always was and it always will be, science.

Incorrect

Inherently flawed.

science is incomplete not deluded.

1:09 PM

It doesn't claim anything beyond it.

if certain assumptions hold true, then certain results can be expected. one does not have to know if these assumptions actually hold true to be able to learn the implications of if they did

Delusions are purely the purview of people who say things beyond the scope of science.

1:10 PM

Science is simply measurement.

Science misinterpretation of reality is endlessly willfully used as a cudgel to enslave and control, with many sophisticated-sounded arguments proffered by all manner of sophists for all sorts of reasons that have nothing whatsoever to do with respect for higher things.

1:11 PM

It's a cult.

Breloomancer

if certain assumptions hold true, then certain results can be expected. one does not have to know if these assumptions actually hold true to be able to learn the implications of if they did

But any assumption can lead to multiple conclusions. This makes the assumptions inherently unwise to indulge in.

Like all the other cults.

Science should purely be based on observation.

1:11 PM

Or it is in many regards not science.

It has a point, but this particular cult read too much Aristotle or something and now their brains are messed up.